New 33TBH and Chinese Tires

These are discussions that contain lots of good info, so did not want to eliminate it. It has closed so we can take advantage of making the forum easier to find what you are looking for.

New 33TBH and Chinese Tires

Postby fish70mg » Tue Jul 10, 2007 2:49 pm

I have read much about the negatives of the Chinese tires and of course mine has Karrier ie Kenda tires. Interested in thoughts good and bad about keeping them or what to replace them with.
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Postby gmarker » Tue Jul 10, 2007 3:44 pm

I spent hours reading posts on differant forums and talking to fellow campers about these Chinese made tires. Seems like the failure rate is way beyond anything I wanted to take a chance on. The most popular replacement suggestion I received was Michelin XPS Rib Lt. I could not find any references to failures on the Michelins which seems to indicate that there haven't been many. They are probably the most expensive but I bit the bullet and ordered a set. Had them put on this past week. While at the tire shop I had the opportunity to compare the Kendra and the Michelin side by side and after doing so, I felt like it was probably the smartest thing I have ever bought for my 5er.
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Postby Olbird » Tue Jul 10, 2007 4:17 pm

Hello Fish70mg,

Take the time to read my post on the tires that come on the Cardinals and the tire ratings that I did a lot of research on.

Most all are very happy with Michelin XPS Rib Lt, but check the load ratings needed for your 2008 axles and wheels.

I would spend the money and get a name brand tire on your rig, I really don't care if the tire company pays for the repairs if a tire blows, I do not want the problems that come with replacing the side of the camper. If you ever seen the damage that a blown tire can do you would understand my concerns.

George:
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Chinese tires

Postby fish70mg » Tue Jul 10, 2007 4:54 pm

Thanks for the 3 replies. I have been reading the other forums and now Goodyear has gone the Chinese. There have been some statements about the advantage of ST tires in flexing and side wall construction vs LT tires. Locally I am having difficulty finding a RV tire expert but am not giving up. Michelin may be the only US tire left and I do not know if they make an ST tire.

Thanks
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Postby snuffy » Tue Jul 10, 2007 7:03 pm

Goodyear has an RV tire in LT235-85-16 that compares favorably with the Michelins.

http://www.goodyear.com/rv/pdf/rv_inflation.pdf
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Postby campswithcritters » Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:55 am

I have been running my Michelin XPS Rib LT tires on mine for about 23000 miles. They will hold up at least that much longer judging tread wear and no probs with the stiff sidewalls, they have done many sharp turns on pavement and gravel with no ill effect. They are a very strong tire and I will purchase them again when the need arises.
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Postby Chief409 » Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:32 pm

All the tire discussion here and on RV.Com got me looking up information on the Web as we have a trip planned to Salt Lake City coming up in October. Around 800 miles one way on I15 and Cal SR58. I found some information on the Discount Tire/America's Tire Center Web site that is interesting.

http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/infoTr ... 0FM0Hj9ZzN

Some snips: (there's plenty more on the website)

ST tires are rated for 65 mph MAX
Trailer tires are designed for a life of 5000 to 10000 miles or 3 to 5 years and not to "wear out"
ALWAYS INFLATE TRAILER TIRES TO THE MAX PRESSURE STATED ON THE SIDEWALL

I've been dealing with America's Tire for around 20 years, and I've found them to be "straight talking". Sometimes a employee will have bad information, but by going to the store manager I've always been able to resolve any questions. The lifetime tire rotation and tire repair for free is nice also.

Now I tow at 60 mph as that's the "sweet spot" for my combination for power and gas milage, and have had my doors blown off by many other rigs on the multilane roads. I've also seen plenty of rigs with damage from blowouts too.

Some food for thought here.
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Postby Judi » Sat Jul 28, 2007 7:07 am

Ok...mine are Load Star (I believe that is the name of them). Should I be concerned with this brand too? Have a brand new 30TS and I would hate the thought of changing them out with the red bird only being only 3 weeks old but I need to know some thoughts on this brand too.
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Postby Chief409 » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:10 am

From web searches it looks like there is only one American name mfgr of ST rated tires, Goodyear. On other forums they have been hammered, badly, for everything posted here. Other then Goodyear, there appears to be three or four other brands, which appear to be made in guess where.

We also have a brand new Cardinal, with less then 2000 miles on it so far. I'm thinking of putting on new tires, but I need to take a good look at the ones on there, which I can't do until the rig comes back from the dealer (in for post trip warrenty work).

Either way, I'll keep the pressure to the max on the sidewall (is that within the alloy rim specs?), and tow at 60.
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Postby Olbird » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:27 am

Hello Judi,

The Load Star tires are Kendas; they have a few names they are using stamped on the tires.

Changing tire brands and when needs to be a decision you make, what I mean is you can go to any RV forum and review tire problems on any model, make of trailers, motor homes, horse trailers and find tire problems.

We all feel we are doing the correct maintenance and taking all the precautions to prevent a tire problem and many still have a blowout causing major damage to the rigs. I suggest if you are always thinking you are going to have a tire problem and it has you worried every time you hook up the camper and causing stress while driving then make a change at any cost.

If you believe you are taking all the correct precautions and the problem is others are overloading, not maintaining proper pressures and you can drive and enjoy your trip every time you hook up than do not change the tires.

Tire brand choice can only be made doing some research (ALL BRANDS CAN HAVE A PROBLEM from time to time and they do, and other brands seem to have more then normal problems as always being discuss.

Most all are very happy with Michelin XPS Rib Lt, but check the load ratings needed for your axles and wheels. Michelin XPS Rib load ratings do not go as high as needed on the large rigs.

Many of the high dollar large 5th wheel manufactures like Teton, Mobile Suites and others use Good Year and are even going with 17 inch wheels with Good Years for the needed high load ratings.

I hope I made a little sense along with trying to bring down some of frustration level many have with tires.

I did change my Load Stars because blowing a tire was on my mind night and day, It feels better now but I know it can still happen.
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Postby pops91710 » Sat Jul 28, 2007 11:19 am

This tire question keeps coming up in forums all over the 'net. And the other big question that keeps rising to the surface is why does Cardinal keep putting on those Chinese tires. Like Ol' Bird (George) I have been doing tire research for a long, long time.

First let me say this. My Cardinal 5th wheel is by far the heaviest trailer I have ever owned. It is my third trailer and my first 5th wheeler. In all the 35 years I have been towing trailers, I have never had one blow-out. A long time ago I invested in an air compressor and use it religiously to keep my tires roadworthy.

I have towed to Utah from southern California at least two dozen times, or more. I have towed to the California Sierras at least six or seven times and to Wyoming's Tetons. I am lucky to live 50miles from some nice mountain camping areas that I also visit at least two or three times a year.

Okay, Why does cardinal put on these Kendas? In all my research I have found no manufacturer other than Kenda or Maxxis that have the necessary specs in a standard ST 16" tire. And, Kenda's 16 beats Maxxis 16" by about 100 pounds. That times four is a 400 lb difference. Trailer tires should exceed the max gvwr of a trailer by 20%. My Karrier's say max load is 3500....that's 14,000 for four. A good safety margin.

If Cardinal fails to match the tires to the coach's load capacity, they are liable in a law suit, but if Kenda's tires fail, and their rated for that specific coach weight, then either the owner or Kenda is at fault.

Said another way, they simply cannot put Michelins on a trailer when Michelin's best XPS doesn't even come close to the required rating. Like George says, I don't know how you are getting away with using them. One blow out and you are on your own. Michelin can legally walk away from it saying they aren't ST's nor rated for such loads.

I prefer to use ST's because they are built for that type of load and service. But, in the end, what will it come down to? Maxxis or Firestone's (Light Truck) Transforce HT's (which I have on my truck) that come very close to the Karrier rating? I haven't yet decided.

It won't be long and I will be standing down for the season and I can put this decision off for another 8 months!

Read the following and you will see why I dropped my injunction against using LT's in place of ST's:Special Trailer Tires Vs Passenger Tires

There are distinct differences in the way passenger tires and trailer tires are
designed, engineered, and constructed. There are also differences in the service
requirements between the tires on your car or truck and those on your trailer.
Traction, or grip, is a key element in the design of passenger tires. Traction
moves your car or truck down the road. Traction allows you to stop, turn and
swerve, and traction also gives you the ability to tow your trailer. Another
important consideration in passenger tire design is “ride”. Ride, traction, and
handling are all achieved in passenger tire designs by adding flex in the sidewall.
By making the sidewall more flexible, tire engineers maximize tread contact with
the road, thus increasing traction and allowing the driver to maintain better
control over the vehicle.

Traction is only a factor on trailers equipped with brakes, during braking
operations, because trailers are followers. In fact, sidewall flexing in a trailer
application is a negative. Sidewall flexing on trailers carrying heavy loads;
trailers with high vertical side loads (enclosed/travel trailers); or trailers with light
tongue weights, is a primary cause of trailer sway. Automotive radial tires with
their flexible sidewalls notably accentuate trailer sway problems. The stiffer
sidewalls and higher operating pressures common with Special Trailer (ST) tires
helps control and reduce the occurrence of trailer sway. Bottom line, trailers are
more stable and pull better on tires designed specifically for trailer use.
Also consider that all Light Truck (LT) and Special Trailer (ST) tires are fully rated
for trailer applications. This means the tires can carry their full sidewall weight
rating when used on a trailer. When passenger tires are used on a trailer, the
load capacity of tire must be de-rated by 10%. If the tire has a maximum load
rating of 1900 lb., it may only be used in a trailer application up to 1710 lb. This
means the GAWR rating on the trailer Certification Label must not exceed 3420
lbs. On a single axle trailer, or 2 times 1710 lbs.

For trailer use, it is important to match the tires to the application and payload.
Since Special Trailer (ST) tires are constructed with more and heavier materials,
they are tougher and more bruise resistant than typical passenger tires. This is a
plus because trailer suspension systems are generally stiffer and less
sophisticated than automotive suspension systems. A tire designed to operate in
the more demanding trailer environment will provide end users a longer service
life and withstand the added abuse tires on a trailer experience.
Bias ply Special Trailer tire technology has been moving trailers around America
for nearly 30 years, and more recently, the ST Radial arrived on the scene
providing the same durability and dependability in a radial trailer tire. For many
trailer buyers, tire decisions are purely price based. The allure of an equal price
and the word “radial” for that price draws some customers to the passenger tire.
Taskmaster hopes this explanation of the differences will help you make a more
informed decision on your next trailer tire purchase.

Sorry, I hope I haven't bored you all.
Mike Harrington, Chino, CA.

2006 Cardinal WB/LE 30'
2003 F250 Superduty V10, 4X4, 4.30 axles and Gear Vendors over/underdrive.
With one happy wife now 45 years ago!
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Postby snuffy » Sat Jul 28, 2007 4:54 pm

My new Marathon ST's are made in China. The old ones were made in Canada but they were 5 years old.
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Postby Sneakypete & Cowgirl » Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:41 pm

Amen mike it was finally said the way it should be. If you drive fast you have to brake harder and the side walls suffer.
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Postby campswithcritters » Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:50 pm

I still will back my Michelin XPS Ribs, they are all under the weight rating at 80 psi, no problems in over 24000 miles and tread wear is minimal. I will buy these tires again because of the durability and general good performance. I will also likely put them on my truck when replacement is due.
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Postby Mike Clay » Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:55 am

Michelin XPS here also. Had 40k+ on my last 5er no problems and over 10k with the Michelin's on this one (new set) I had Good Year on the last 5er and lost two side walls. Yes it was hard to get rid of a brand new set of china tires I had less than 800 miles on them. But now I can drive looking forward instead of watching my tires in the mirror all the time.
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