5th wheel hitch

[Olbird]

If you can raise the 5th wheel hitch in the truck, this allows the complete pin box on the trailer to go up for more turning clearance.
Raising your pin box at the frame should not have caused problems.

[Rodney]

Thank you everyone for the info. I had the wings of my pin box cut off and had the Rota Flex pin arm dropped down one nut hole which gave me approximately 2 inches lift on the bird and I now clear my bed side while turning 90. However now I have a really rough ride and the bird must bouncing all around in the rear cause my drawer from the sleeper couch moved about 6 inches away from the wall. With the corrections on the Rota Flex arm I'm still a little down on the nose of the bird but I think my air bags will take care of that. I'm debating weather to put the Rota flex arm back to it's original position and take my chances on the 90 turns. Does anyone have any suggestions?

[watkinsk]

A dumb question....but I have to ask it.

When I discovered my problem with the Rota Flex being too long and too low (not clearing the sides by about 1 inch) my first reaction---because I didn't want to cut the hitch pin---was to simply get two 2 or 3 inch high spacer bars of tubular steel about 2 feet long to go between the rails of my hitch and the bed of the truck....thus lifting the hitch another 2-3 inches.

Would doing this cause some problems with the weight and moment of the tow and possibly cause problems in turns, etc? It would certainly be cheaper than installing the $564 Mor/ryde hitch pin i just ordered!!!

Keith

[Chief409]

Perhaps this is old fashioned, but before trying to correct the problem yourself, go to a Authorised Dealer or Installer for the hitch installed in your truck and have them look at the problem.

When I traded my '05 F250 in on the '09 F350 I sure wasn't aware the frame was the same, and that my Reese/DrawTite Signature 18K hitch was a straight remove and install on the new truck. Left to myself I'd more then likely spent more then the cost of having the Reese Dealer removing the hitch from the old truck and installing it in the new truck.

And, for what it's worth - with my hitch I've never had "Chucking". If the hitch grasps the pin tightly, no chucking. Smooth ride, with the '05 F250, yes, mostly because the rear suspension was loaded just short of max. On the '09, Ford made so many suspension changes, empty or loaded I have a Cowboy Lincoln. Even my DIEHARD GM buddy says my dually empty is as smooth as his 2010 1/2 ton empty. So, I have the fixed Lippert 18K pinbox on the 'Bird. And after 60,000 - 80,000 miles or so, towing the 'Bird behind two trucks, using the same Reese/DrawTite Signature 18K hitch, I won't be changing anything. OBTW, the Reese Signature hitch (Ford Branded) is now available as a factory option from Ford on the 2011 trucks.

[Olbird]

Many 5th wheel hitches have adjustment within the the hitch frame work to raise and lower, I would not have a problem raising the hitch in the truck at lower rails with the proper designed steel support.
But if you are not good at this type mods go to a shop that knows, or change to a adjustable 5th wheel hitch. Moving the trailer closer to the rear of the truck with a shorter pin box is not a good idea, you would be better off raising the front of the trailer and think about if you ever needed the trailer to be towed by a long bed truck.

[tsg1jxd]

I just bought a new 3515RT and I had the same issue. I have a Pullrite Superglide hitch with 3" lifters. The Dealership had never come across this before so they contacted FR and Pullright. Apparently neither one was very helpful. I was not keen on cutting the king pin on a brand new trailer. When I bought my new 5th wheel, I had traded a 2005 Coachmen Chapperal 282DS which had no issues with my setup. On a whim, the dealership took the king pin off my trade and installed it on my new camper and it fit just fine. Apparently, there are long and short length versions of the king pin and they also can be angled higher or lower. Once we knew that my old king pin would work, the dealership is now ordering me a new king pin from FR with the correct dimensions to fit. I will post pictures once I get the unit back from the dealership.

Hope this helps!

[Torben]

Glad to hear that the dealership and FR is taken care of the issue , and welcome to the club

[Rob & Cathy]

Hi Jay and Dawn, glad to hear you found a solution to your problem and thanks for passing on the information. And welcome to the club.

Rob

[Travelers]

There are multiple pin boxes to fit various applications. This maybe useful.

http://www.trailair.com/products/airpin/whichpinbox.pdf


And welcome to the club.

[watkinsk]

If you recall, about 3 weeks ago I purchased a totally like new (used) 2010 Cardinal 3150. I immediately had a problem with the Rota Flex hitch being too long and too low in my truck bed to clear either the tailgate or the side of the truck when the hitch was in maneuver position. Worse yet, there was no way to adjust the Rota Flex to gain the greater angle or to raise my hitch, which was in the top position. I have a 2004.5 Dodge Reg Bed and a Reese 16K sliding hitch.

I considered trying to cut the King Pin assembly like Mike and others had done to give a better angle and try to shorten the King Pin. After doing lots of measurements, talking to Camping World techs, other dealer techs, two independent RV repairman, then talking to Forest River and Lippert (mfg of the TrailAir RotaFlex), I elected to purchase a shorter King Pin, i.e, a Lippert 0179 compatible king pin. I purchased a Mor/Ryde king pin that fits the Lippert 0719 model.. This Mor/Ryde king pin is approximately 8.5 inches shorter than the RotaFlex that was standard equip on the Cardinal.

Today I got the new Mor/Ryde installed and IT WORKS. The rig tows beautifully and most importantly , it can make more than a 45 degree turn without kissing the side of the truck bed or the tailgate. After all adjustments I was able to lower my Reese Hitch by two inches and the clearance between the top of the truck bed and the bottom of the 5th Wheel's overhang is about 7.25 inches. For those with similar problems, I recommend considering the shorter King Pin versus cutting the OEM king pin. After a short tow around an obstacle course, to include backing up and trying to jack=knife the rig, and then traveling on the freeway, I have no problems, no chucking, and plenty of room to maneuver either in a Tow Position or Maneuver Position.

BTW, I purchased the Mor/Ryde from Tweety's.COM for $564 including shipping. Installation costs were $89. Camping World and other dealers were $899 to #999 plus tax.

I want to thank everyone on this board for their ideas and inputs...invaluable to a newby like myself.

Now for my concern....I will write a letter to FR to discuss the absolutely horrendous engineering design that put the Rota Flex on the Cardinal with a Turret Receiver box that doesn't have any latitude for adjustments. Worse yet, when I called FR they said there had been no other recorded complaints or history of a similar problem with the Rota Flex. Clearly they don't monitor this website as others clearly have had to jury-rig their hitch pin to get it to work correctly and permit full maneuverability. FR insisted there are no alternative king pins and that the problem rested with Lippert. Lippert was very helpful but said they are not responsible for the FR engineering or installation...to include the idiotic placement of the electrical box at the outside of the King Pin thereby extending the length of the Rota Flex another 2 inches more than necessary. In the end, Lippert and MOR/RYDE provded great support but I would grade Forest River an "F" for both engineering design and failure to acknowledge a potential problem and then offer at least an alternative other than pointing the finger at Lippert. Just my $.02!

[Travelers]

Congrat's on your resolution. It's nice to feel comfortable towing your rig.

Maybe I have the terminalogy wrong, but I think Mike and I cut the frame NOT the King Pin.



This is mine after cutting and reinstalling the pin box and wiring. I wonder what brand / type of vehicle the original owner of your 3150 was using?

[watkinsk]

Yes you are correct, I should have said cutting the frame, not the King Pin. My frame looks similar to your picture so I assume they are the same. If you compare most receiver frames on earlier Cardinals and other brands such as Montana and BigHorn, they have the ability to "adjust" the height of the King Pin. This frame on my 3150 does not have that option. Interestingly, in my discussions with all of RV maintenance guys at Camping World and the other two local places I visited, plus my call to FR and Lippert, every one of them recommended against cutting the receiver frame....I guess out of concern that a bad cut could somehow weaken the frame (personally I don't see how this could happen with a cut like yours)

Even by cutting the frame as you did, everyone I talked to felt the clearance of the frame during the pivot of the King Pin would still have been minimal and could potential cause a problem on an uneven road. Another problem I faced in cutting the frame was that I would have had to haul the rig to someone who could do the cut. Unfortunately I didn't have the ability to back the rig out of the Cul de Sac without making a pivot/turn that would have sent the King Pin and Frame into the side of the Dodge. So I was stuck with few options.

Bottom line, I now have a Rota Flex for sale, used by the previous owner about 3-4 times and myself on 1 20 mile trip! That may help to pay for the cost of the new Mor/Ryde and it's installation.

I just wish that somehow we could identify why some of us have a problem and most do not have a problem with the King Pin's length.

[Travelers]

Glad all is correct. Now go out and enjoy that great rig.

[bfast54]

Yes you are correct, I should have said cutting the frame, not the King Pin. My frame looks similar to your picture so I assume they are the same. If you compare most receiver frames on earlier Cardinals and other brands such as Montana and BigHorn, they have the ability to "adjust" the height of the King Pin. This frame on my 3150 does not have that option.

I just wish that somehow we could identify why some of us have a problem and most do not have a problem with the King Pin's length.

One big reason, is the Manufacturers Change the dimensions on their trucks every so often (not only at the end , or start of a year, many times during) the model year.

They change the dimensions of the box, frame height ..Ride height ..... you name it.

[Chief409]

I'm glad John put up the link to the different sizes and types of 5er pin boxes, because it isn't "one size or style fits all" as I've learned from reading about others problems over the years. Knowing there are choices available can solve a problem, before it BECOMES a problem. The Dealers and RV shops should have this information posted "up front" and ensure their employees are aware of it, too.

I'm just glad I got lucky when we got the 'Bird, I had no clue. Now if that luck would produce a winning Lotto Ticket "the World Would Be Great!"

Thanks John