First tow with 6.7 Ford

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WVcampers
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First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by WVcampers »

We only travelled 90 miles each way but the power of the Ford was impressive. This is the first time that I could set the cruise and just drive. That is saying alot on the hilly, never flat, roads of West Virginia. The ride was smooth but I did notice what I believe is some oversteer when towing that I don't have without the trailer hooked up. The camper is a little high in the front and I don't see any way to lower it. The hitch and pin box are as low as they can go. I need to measure before and after hooking up, but it looks like the front of the truck did not drop at all. I could not hear any engine noise when towing and my neighbor in the campground could not believe that I left before he got up every morning to get a paper and he never heard a thing. This is the quietest diesel that I have ever heard. Average fuel milage while towing was 11.5 with the cruise set on 70 mph. The truck now has 1980 miles on it. I think that this truck is a keeper :thumbrt:
Randy & Carol
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Mike Clay »

Glad your new truck did well :thumbrt: The new ones are quiet
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Chief409 »

Impressive, especially the MPG. It's been a few years, and two Fords (250 and the 350 dually), but I recall feeling somewhat light on the front with the original hitch set up for the Reese Signature 18K and the 250. I looked at the base of the hitch with the receiver off and noticed that by taking the base off the mounts and rotating it 180 degrees, the posts the receiver mounts on would move forward around 1 1/2". I tried that and the slight shift of weight forward made the difference on the 250. I've never installed it the other way on the 350, so I don't have a comparison. But the 350 dually is a "Tow Boss" with the extended track front axle, and has a much longer wheelbase then the regular cab, long bed 250. Even after filling up the main 38 gallon tank, and the 50 gallon aux tank from empty, which is mounted in the front of the bed, I don't notice a change in the truck's handling with the 'Bird on the hitch.
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Mike Clay »

I only had 50 lbs of the near 500 on the aux tank transfer to the front axle
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Travelers »

That good news. Always wonder when you get a new truck or rig, did we make the right decision? Sounds like your a happy camper. :thumbrt:
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by WVcampers »

This truck has the camper package to haul a slide-in, snow plow package, and the off road package. I am thinking that the snow plow package is keeping the front from dropping. I really should take it to some scales. We have scales at work, I am going to make it a point to take it in soon. When I do I will post the results.
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Rob & Cathy »

Chief409 wrote:I looked at the base of the hitch with the receiver off and noticed that by taking the base off the mounts and rotating it 180 degrees, the posts the receiver mounts on would move forward around 1 1/2". I tried that and the slight shift of weight forward made the difference on the 250.
I read somewhere that the hitches on Ford should be 1-2 inches forward of the axle. Of course the folks that installed my hitch put it right above the axle. I've weighed the from axle on mine and it comes in at 4060# with or without the trailer.

Rob
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Chief409 »

WVcampers wrote:This truck has the camper package to haul a slide-in, snow plow package, and the off road package. I am thinking that the snow plow package is keeping the front from dropping. I really should take it to some scales. We have scales at work, I am going to make it a point to take it in soon. When I do I will post the results.
I had the same suspension packages on my '05 250. But my 'Bird is listed at over 2100# pin weight dry, without options, then add on the weight of the generator in the front compartment, all the options available and loaded for a long trip, the 250 was riding with the rear squatted down. So moving the pivot point forward from directly over the axle when I turned the hitch around is what improved the handling. I considered Timberlin's or air bags, to fix the squat, then decided to go to the 350 dually when I saw it on the lot.

There is a CAT scale where I'm fueling at the beginning and end of our next trip, I think I'll get the full and empty fuel tank weight's done. I know what my wallet weight will be after filling up! :roll:
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by WVcampers »

Checked today and the hitch is installed so that the pin is 3" in front of the rear axel. I don't know if tire pressure would cause oversteer but the front tires have 65 lbs and the rear have 80. The tires are rated for 80 max.
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Mike Clay »

Thats what mine are set at
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Chief409 »

As installed, my pin was TDC on the axle. I've looked at a few HDC rigs, even with the sliding hitch on the tandem axle rigs, on the road most have the king pin forward of the pivot point, unless the trailer is empty. On the single axle HDT rigs the king pin is slightly forward of the axle (no sliding hitch). Which makes sense, if you visualise the vectors involved when making a turn with a towed mass either at, or forward of the pivot point (the rear axle) of the towing vehicle. Unless the tow vehicle is close to, or greater in mass then the towed vehicle, a pivot point should be forward, not by much, of the towing vehicle pivot point. A hitch set up at the pivot point, could cause severe oversteer, depending on the tow vehicle size to the towed vehicle. Bruce (Campswithcritters) briefly addressed this in his thread about his new HDT.

Or, remember towing a heavy conventional trailer, with a marginal tow vehicle, without a equalizer hitch?

As I get older, sometimes it takes a while to think about, and remember references. :lol:
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Mike Clay »

Well you lost me right after "as installed" :-B Chevy wants theirs TDC
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by campswithcritters »

From all my research (& boy did I do a lot) yes with a conventional pick-up your pin needs to be TDC of the axle or within 3 inches forward of it to keep proper control & balance in all situations. Exception would be slider hitches for maneuvering with short beds at very low speeds when the pin moves aft of the rear axle.
My situation is completely different as I have over 10K lbs front axle weight on an empty truck and my hitch is 2 ft aft of the TDC of the pivot point (between the 2 rear axles) on my tandem axle truck, I make up for it by loading a car on the truck and about 40% of it's 1800 lbs goes to the front axle. Loaded up my front axle is still over 10K lbs, I kept it tandem to avoid going over the 12K front axle rating when I have only the car on board without trailer and full fuel (which is forward also). My positioning of the hitch allows the the trailer to go 90 degrees without hitting my car and makes the trailer follow more like a conventional trailer helping with the long length of the entire unit.
If you are feeling an oversteer (ie rear end loose) double check tire pressure at the rear and sidewall strength of those rear tires, it should not feel like that with all that weight. If it is an understeer (ie you turn the wheel and truck continues straight ahead) you need more weight on the front by moving hitch forward. Most trucks hauling a fiver will not squat at all in the front while hitching the 5ver, this is not a weight distributing system, front axle weight should stay same or increae a small amount like 2 to 300 lbs.
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Mike Clay »

Yep I agree with that even at top dead center 150 lbs goes to the front with 18.98% pin weight from the trailer total
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Re: First tow with 6.7 Ford

Post by Chief409 »

What I'm thinking about is in a decel situation into a curve. With the pin weight TDC over the rear axle you would feel a perceived oversteer because the steering wheels would be loaded less. Just like a conventional trailer without a equalizer hitch. Granted, not as much with a fifth wheel, but something that you would notice because of the weight transfer.

With a SRW tow vehicle this could become very noticeable with the sidewall flex of radial tires.
Jeff & Terry
U.S.N. Ret
2012 F350 Lariat FX4 6.7 Diesel Dually, Crew Cab, LWB, 50 gal Transfer Flow toolbox/tank
2007 Cardinal 30WBLE, "the 'Bird", ONAN gen.
The more I see in my travels, the more I realize there is so much more to see.
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