To DEF or not?

[watkinsk]

I am considering trading our 2004.5 Dodge 3500 (5.9 cummins) for a 2011 Ford 350 or 2011 Dodge 3500. Of course the 2011 Dodge doesn't use DEF and the 2011 Ford requires DEF.
From a pure power perspective it appears the Ford beats the Dodge BUT I am afraid of the DEF issue. Following everyone's problems with DEF pumps, I am just not sure it is worth the pain and risk of having one more thing to break on a truck.

BTW, I live at 8700 ft elevation so the winters are regularly below zero at night (I thought I read somewhere that DEF doesn't work well in extreme cold!)

Any opinions regarding whether DEF is worth the pain?

Thanks! Keith

[bfast54]

From the reasearch I have done on this Issue, with your climate..... I would hold off a couple more years, till they get it right.. ..I believe John, Travelers.had his DEF Pump freeze up.. ..a hassle I believe. Course , this is just my view.

[WVcampers]

The DEF will freeze. Ford has a heater in the system. It works after you start the truck. The truck is allowed to run without DEF until it is thawed. The only precaution is to keep the DEF tank less than full to allow for expansion when it freeses. If the tank is full it will crack and require replacement. The trucks use very little DEF, and warns you in time to add some if needed. I have not found it to ba problem. My truck is 1 year old and has 10,100 miles on it. I have added 8.5 gallons, the tank is full now.

[Mike Clay]

Same with Chevy heats the fluid no problems with mine 27,000 miles heading for two years

[Rob & Cathy]

I am considering trading our 2004.5 Dodge 3500 (5.9 cummins) for a 2011 Ford 350 or 2011 Dodge 3500. Of course the 2011 Dodge doesn't use DEF and the 2011 Ford requires DEF.

The use of DEF has not been an issue at all. You're right though Keith that it's one less thing to maintain and service if you go with the Dodge.

Rob

[bfast54]

I checked the posts.....John...Travelers posted on Oct 10, that his DEF froze, and he had to drain, and refill....it seperated. So, I will stand by my first post....I am not so sure all the bugs are out yet.

[Mike Clay]

Only because in the beginning there were problems and after his reflash I do not believe he has had any more problems

[bfast54]

OK Mike... .. Like I say........ This is just My opinion.......... I am leery of some of this New Technology,.........if you know what I mean.

He (Keith) commented he gets some pretty cold temps..(below Zero at night)...as we do in Michigan. So, that is what I am base-ing my view on.
As far as I know, the heater only works when truck is running?????? What about the truck sitting for 8-10-12 hrs overnight.....won't the fluid freeze, and cause the issues John had??? Just asking...I do not know. I am learnig as well as others about this wave of the present.....to make it all better......................RIGHT . ...

[RetiredFifthWheeler]

As a 2011 Dodge owner, I appreciate not having to deal with the DEF issue at all. I don't know anything about the technical specifications of the Ford vs Dodge. My own experience is that the Dodge pulls my 3640 well and I am satisfied with the purchase we made last year. (We have 21,000+ miles on the truck now.)

[Mike Clay]

Well I am not a fan of the DEF either but what ya going to do. Like the Fords the computer does not call of DEF until the heaters have done their thing. I watch my DEF pump pressure since the problems I had in Mt Rushmore when the pump failed. Even on above freezing days it will read 0 pressure for the first mile or so.

[Olbird]

I now have 3,900 miles on my truck and have not added DEF or been warned to add any, we had many days of freezing conditions and the truck showed no signs of any problems.
All Diesel vehicle manufactures will have DEF systems soon to meet government emission laws and I have no idea how Dodge keeps getting extensions to prolong the DEF system install to their trucks.

[Mike Clay]

Dodge has it now I believe

[Chief409]

Ram doesn't have DEF, yet. From the 2012 Ram web site:

Available Turbo Diesel with 350 Horsepower with 800 pound-feet of Torque (with automatic transmission, 610 pound-feet with manual transmission)
Meets 50-state emissions with no diesel exhaust fluid (DEF) required
Ram 2500 offers 15,500 pounds max trailer weight+ and up to 22,500 pounds GCWR+
3500 Max Tow package with 22,750-pound maximum towing capacity+
Available Mega Cab® has large interior volume


Jeff

[snoking]

The down side of Dodge Ram not using DEF on the pickups (It is on the chassis cabs) is two fold!

1. Lower MPG by a couple MPG.
2. Diesel dilution of the crank case oil, and much earlier oil changes.

I am not ready for a third Dodge Cummins until they address these two major issues. I could live with not being to first to the top of Davis Dam hill in Arizona in a new Dodge and being able to come back down it with the best exhaust brake available, and also the best service brakes. However the two items above are show stoppers for me.

I average around 12 MPG towing with my current truck and to not want to move up to a truck the gets less than 10 MPG towing. Even with 4:10 gears I can get 19-20 on a road trip and 15 around town. The new Dodges will not do that.

I would not also own one of these new trucks without a good warranty, which means a costly extended warranty if you are going to keep it a long time. There is not much one can fix themselves anymore on these new trucks (maybe on the Dodge a little bit). Phone Home!!!!


Chris

[Mike Clay]

I thought that the 2012 are using it, but after reading more I guess not.